*** [TSR] *** Episode 13 - Continuing Day After Day - :)

[KashimArbalestAS]

The LD is the most flexible and arcane weapon in the Full Metal Panic! universe. When Sousuke fought, he put all his skill, trust, and passion into the Arbalest and its LD. That, like Clouzot said, is the difference between battling. The novel seems to be more clear on that. He didn't just flicked his wrists and destroyed the execution unit. He put his all, which was more than enough for any of them. The weapon doesn't make a man, Sousuke used the LD to an extent that none of the execution unit members could have ever dreamed of. His shots were laden with the LD, that's why it's been making short work of the other AS, Sousuke and the Arbalest/Lambda Driver were stronger. Look at the execution unit compared to Sousuke. They were just "using" their AS like a tool, and used their LD to do the basics of defence, offense, etc. Sousuke put his all into the machine. Like Clouzot said, the AS now are extensions of a skilled warrior's body, and coupled with Sousuke's newfound strength with the Lambda Driver/Arbalest/AI, it brought the Arbalest's level even higher. This has all been covered with Clouzot's earlier arrival in the novel.

But even with Sousuke and the Arbalest, in Continuing On My Own, he still...Shows that he isn't the strongest in the world.

[danny]

When you consider Tessa's words in Episode 8, where she tells him to get his mind off Kaname and to focus on piloting the Arbalest, it shows the clash as plainly as you could ever hope for. Hatred, depression, frustration, confusion... however you wish to describe it, it's pretty clear that you're supposed to interpret the situation as Sousuke having to choose between the Arbalest and Kaname. (Of course, if the Arbalest's Lambda Driver was perfect, Sousuke wouldn't have so many superiors breathing down his neck trying to force him away from Kaname so he can practice with it, right?)

And regarding the matchups and ending... Obviously, you don't follow the novels. It's not over yet, not by a long shot.

I dont know if you are trying to support Taurecs arguement of the Arablast being one of the reasons why Souske being depressed but it doesnt seem so. You just stated a new arguement in this thread from what it looks like, which is choosing between Arbalest and kaname Chidori which you can make the arguement.

[danny]

The LD is the most flexible and arcane weapon in the Full Metal Panic! universe. When Sousuke fought, he put all his skill, trust, and passion into the Arbalest and its LD. That, like Clouzot said, is the difference between battling. The novel seems to be more clear on that. He didn't just flicked his wrists and destroyed the execution unit. He put his all, which was more than enough for any of them. The weapon doesn't make a man, Sousuke used the LD to an extent that none of the execution unit members could have ever dreamed of. His shots were laden with the LD, that's why it's been making short work of the other AS, Sousuke and the Arbalest/Lambda Driver were stronger. Look at the execution unit compared to Sousuke. They were just "using" their AS like a tool, and used their LD to do the basics of defence, offense, etc. Sousuke put his all into the machine. Like Clouzot said, the AS now are extensions of a skilled warrior's body, and coupled with Sousuke's newfound strength with the Lambda Driver/Arbalest/AI, it brought the Arbalest's level even higher. This has all been covered with Clouzot's earlier arrival in the novel.

But even with Sousuke and the Arbalest, in Continuing On My Own, he still...Shows that he isn't the strongest in the world.

Im not denying that Souske put all his passion and wit into the Arblast, but strange isnt it that he had many problems working the Arablast and then a few words from Chidori and he all of sudden in the very last episode (and in just a few minutes I might add)knows how to work the Arablast with the Lamba Driver to the maximum and defeat everybody with a switch of the wrist. And I mean doing some new tricks that were not seen before or pratice. That is my point, it shouldnt be that easy to defeat those guys just like that. Gates had knew LD extremly well in his Venom, he was holding back Souske and the rest Mithril in the trap episodes. Gates had to know that meaning of operating the machine to be an extension of his own body just like you said for Souske, or else he wouldnt be that good to begin with. Souske was not the only one possesing the skills, knowledge of LD and making the machine an extension of the mind and body. Gates had it also and it should of been a good battle, not just BAM BAM and your dead. Where is the excitement in that.

The writers just decided to close the series in this old fashion way of the main character being depressed for some reason and then gets a pec talk from another main character and then just devours the enemy. This is like alot of those Ninja Karate movies when the main student is losing to the main villian and then he has a flashback showing his master saying that he needs to release his inner strenght cause he is the chosen one and no else can and then, KA-CHING, he finds the inner strength and beats everybody.

[KashimArbalestAS]

The writers? More like Gatoh Shoji. You are aware that all the animes are based off of the novels? That is the reason why Gates had to lose, because that "angry bast*rd" commander of the execution unit Gauron described as lost to Sousuke pretty much the same way. Erase the hair part...Sousuke didn't suddenly learn new tricks and moves that he could implement with the LD, in his mind he knew and believed he could win. The LD is manipulated by the pilot's thoughts and such. And Sousuke had a new reason and stuff, like Kaname being back and trusting the machine, and all that other stuff, but believe what you want. Gates was good, the execution unit in the novels were good, but Sousuke still destroyed them. Gates isn't an amateur, we know that, but he still lost. I mean, in almost the whole episode Sousuke has been blasting away his armor and watching the Arbalest decimate one Codarl at a time. You can't blame him for being scared, or thinking that the Arbalest could reach him with the LD like that.

I don't know, this isn't your normal "hero gets depressed and then comes back with girl even stronger than before." If it was, then Gatoh has been gearing up for that one battle for I don't know how many novels. This problematic situation of Sousuke and the Arbalest started ever since Sousuke got into the cockpit of the Arbalest, it just manifested itself in The End of Day by Day. Kaname did wake him up anyway and beat some sense into him.

[AEmer]

IRT Danny: (edited)

The script writers?, let me tell you what they could have done instead:

They could make Gates seem like a weakling. They could've stripped the execution squad of members, and taken some of their bigass weapons away. Would that have been better?

Because they couldn't have changed the outcome, which by the way was visible from a mile off in the novels.

I think you should stop and think, though, if the ease with which Sousuke gained this victory isn't entirely intended.

The Lambda driver is a technology that's not supposed to exist. Sousuke was not supposed to be able to beat the Behemoth. In fact, he wasn't supposed to be able to beat any of the lambda driver enemies, since he isn't drugged, and they are, so they have no trouble operating it (Gates was drugged too, most likely...I doubt the Assasin was, but it's unclear)...

The whole idea of Sousuke opening a can of whoopass so suddenly _does_ alieanate a fair part of the viewers, I'd say...Personally, I found myself alieanated when I read the novel, not at all thinking about how cool it is to grab an enemy AS with a wire, but only about 'huh, so this asswhooping will just continue on uninterrupted, eh?'...

Part of the drive within the novel was to have Sousuke come to terms with using the Arbalast...it's the main mecha, but throughout the novels, and to a certain degree during both the manga and the anime, Sousuke has had a very destinct distaste for it...it's an incomplete weapon...

Sousuke, however, is an incomplete person. In a way, the Arbalast and Sousuke are very similar - but Sousuke had to come to terms with this fact in order to be able to use the arbalast as an extension of himself...this theme was very important in the novels (in fact, I believe Gatoh comments in the afterword that the intention with the novel, the main drive, was getting the Arbalast and Sousuke to cooperate), and even if wasn't as important in the anime up till this point (because it was, when all comes to all, a minor theme back then), it still had to be made clear during this anime, for the story as a whole to get the right 'flow'...

As for the arguements as to whether or not it was 'out of tune' with the series to have the lambda driver save the day once again...it's a Deus Ex Machina disguised as 'alien'(not extraterestrial, just alien) technology...it's cool...but don't be surprised when it comes jumping in, saving the day...because that's what it was made for.

[danny]

The writers? More like Gatoh Shoji. You are aware that all the animes are based off of the novels? That is the reason why Gates had to lose, because that "angry bast*rd" commander of the execution unit Gauron described as lost to Sousuke pretty much the same way. Erase the hair part...Sousuke didn't suddenly learn new tricks and moves that he could implement with the LD, in his mind he knew and believed he could win. The LD is manipulated by the pilot's thoughts and such. And Sousuke had a new reason and stuff, like Kaname being back and trusting the machine, and all that other stuff, but believe what you want. Gates was good, the execution unit in the novels were good, but Sousuke still destroyed them. Gates isn't an amateur, we know that, but he still lost. I mean, in almost the whole episode Sousuke has been blasting away his armor and watching the Arbalest decimate one Codarl at a time. You can't blame him for being scared, or thinking that the Arbalest could reach him with the LD like that.

I don't know, this isn't your normal "hero gets depressed and then comes back with girl even stronger than before." If it was, then Gatoh has been gearing up for that one battle for I don't know how many novels. This problematic situation of Sousuke and the Arbalest started ever since Sousuke got into the cockpit of the Arbalest, it just manifested itself in The End of Day by Day. Kaname did wake him up anyway and beat some sense into him.

I know the it is from the Novels, that doest affect my point that Im discussing, it ended the way it did and that is what Im arguing against and why it wasnt that great.

If you go back to the Gauron ending, he had a whole crew of people plotting things and making things hard for the whole Mithril gang, not just Souske. It was more than just fighting. He created a plan to invade the Submarine and it was complex with fighting and finding out who were the traitors. Also it wasnt just Souske involved Tessa and Kaname were involved as well using their Whispered powers. Mao and the blonde dude were having their own battles as well and ofcourse there was suspense about Mao being seriously injured and surviving. Get the point and see the difference. Gaurons gang were involved and gave hell to our boys in Mithril, other characters were involved and being used in the finaly of Full Metal Panic I with their abilities as well. I appreciated how they gave that scene of Tessa calling out the names of the Mithril fighters to find out who was alive and dead, it was very touching but showing reality of their line of work and the bad side of being involved, in this ending of Part 2, it was just Souske doing everything and being a one man army (im sure you guys heard that line before), saving the day and getting the girl. Souske had to think and fight obsticles in the FMP 1, in FMP 2 he was a GOD!!

Gates main mission was to get the Arblast. He was preparing to take it somehow. Gates doesnt have to be preparing for anything anyway cause what counts that everybody was defeated with ease by just one man.

Again whatever you say for Souske can be said for Gates as well cause he destroyed the girl who follow Gauron with fair ease, so as I expected he knew how to work the Machine like Gauron did. Souske should not steam roled him, there should of been a war here and with some twists of other fighters getting in the mix of things and making things happend.


I will respond to the other guys post but I have to go to bed and work.

[Nazgul]

I have to agree with Danny on some parts.
Although there is very little known about the LD and the emotional state of the pilot is very important for it's capabileties. It was a very easy ending, even if the suddenly huge gap between Sousuke and the badies capabileties is possible.
And it does remind me of the old Kung Fu/ Karate movies with a sudden come back. It would have been better (in my opinion) to have an other ep and draw out the battle a bit. Make it a little harder for him to win the battle, and possibly even let the other teammates do something usefull

[Taurec]

Souske wasnt depressed because of the Arablast, he had nothing but hatred for the machine. The Arablast didnt contribute to his depression, it was all from not seeing Chidori. Souske was being Souske even after his hatred was shown to the Arablast, he was still seeing Chidori during that time

I used quotes because depressed didn't cover it as a whole. also I stated it was a factor but
for the sake of discussion.....


I didn't want to do it ... but it's Yoda time .... Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.


Now lets see if we could fit Sousuke in it,


Fear, His teamates might get hurt, Him not being perfect.
Anger, The inability to cope with his imperfections just to name one.
Hate, Using the ARX partly as a scapegoat, since at the time he was unable to recognize his own flaws
Suffering, <=> Depression Well you get the idea ...


I suppose Sousuke won the battle against himself and to quote Mwu "Make the impossible possible"

<grin>


(besides think what a large battle would eat out of the budget this way they didn't pull a NGE on us)

[AEmer]

The main problem with doing a battle where Sousuke doesn't kick major ass is that it compromises the premise of the story...it was completely intentional to make him look this powerful...

Including teammates in the battle, and making Sousuke have difficulty with the fighting, while it would be cool...well...it would inevitably decrease the magnitude of Sousukes victory.
Which would be a problem, since he's supposed to win this big.

The final scene would've been better, I agree, if it hadn't turned out this way. But with scenes that are a part of a bigger story, you cannot ever prioritize the individual scene above the story...that Sousuke's victory is so utterly extreme is a concequence of this...

[danny]

I guess I dont have to add about it being something like a western showdown flick. When Souske received the pec talk from Kaname, the Sun rose and he gave that look of now its time to get busy and that I am Back, somewhat like a showdown in the wild wild west! Then slicing his opponents one by one and then Gates doing the "take the injured soldier hostage" trick and later Souske saying you cant beat me cause Im SAGARA SOUSKE!!!!!, he had his main music playing as well, lol 80s

anyway, im done with this episode, will be waiting for the next season.

[HELLFIRE]

...I'll save the long, drawnout selfanalysis, etc...

Sousuke kicked butt right at the eleventh hour... and he's learned something
of himself, and well... he'll still be around, just he wants a few changes to
be made, and if they don't like it, they can shove it

I think Katyusha mentioned something like this once upon a blue moon

















Regards

[KashimArbalestAS]

But all that stuff that you may find corny and stuff are all there for dramatic effect, like the sun part. That's one of the beauties of anime and manga, the drama and unlikely events happening in their world just doesn't happen in the real one. The ending of the first series with Gauron was probably based on defeating Gauron. With the execution unit/Gates, it was more of Sousuke and the Arbalest coming to terms. It is true that they were made to look like cannon fodder, but you're just looking at the wrong battle since the theme wasn't really entirely straightforward with destroying the enemies to conclude a series. Kind of more like it opened a better path for the next animated series.

[Draylock2525]

I'm hoping for another series. I'm thinking there will be a F2 but also I'm thinking there will be another of the FMP itself series. Too many unanwered questions like who was Tessa's brother talking to on the phone. There are still question involving the whispered. And there has to be more romance that grows between Souske and Chidori.

[danny]

But all that stuff that you may find corny and stuff are all there for dramatic effect, like the sun part. That's one of the beauties of anime and manga, the drama and unlikely events happening in their world just doesn't happen in the real one. The ending of the first series with Gauron was probably based on defeating Gauron. With the execution unit/Gates, it was more of Sousuke and the Arbalest coming to terms. It is true that they were made to look like cannon fodder, but you're just looking at the wrong battle since the theme wasn't really entirely straightforward with destroying the enemies to conclude a series. Kind of more like it opened a better path for the next animated series.

I already mention before that it was done this way to close this series for the next one because Leonard is still out there. My point is they could of ended in a more exciting way. Even if he was coming to terms with the Arablast, it shouldnt have been so simple.

If the Sun part was the only thing used then it would of made a difference but as whole the episode was made corney!

[JelliCelli]

Wraith's words in the last ep kinda sealed the deal for me in regards to there being another anime series: "Winter is coming soon..."