Tsudou Make My Day (TMMD) New Novel/Dragon Mag *Spoilers*

[Torii]

3.) Heh, love this part: Leonard asks Kaname how she'd modify the AS designs if it was up to her, and hands her a Codarl model. She promptly adds two more bundles to the head-mounted heat emitters (the "hair"), ties it into a braid, and puts a bow on it before handing it back to Leonard.

Codarl Chidori Custom~

[Pyrite]

He wouldn't have shown Kagome what he did if he weren't trying provoke her sympathy...

Pssst... get some sleep.

Will discuss more on Leonard's character when time permits. For now, one thing: Killer has a point. In Leonard's value system, which may or may not be perverted, betrayal by friends and family ranks as more severe than killing. (A shared view; Dante's lowest level of Hell is reserved for traitors.) And from what we know of Sousuke's experiences, the closest thing we've seen to betrayal on his side are the time Gauron got on board the TDD-1... and Kalinin, but I doubt he knows as yet.

(I wonder what Leonard thinks of Kalinin anyway. And did Sousuke even feel regret about killing until Leonard brought up the matter? I don't think so, but I don't recall.)

And I find it quite hard to hate fictional characters (unless they're really poorly designed/characterised), so pardon me if I'm a little shocked (but not surprised) at the unmitigated hate. Besides, Kaname's already said everything you've said and everything that matters - "So what?"

Of course, for all those who have something against Leonard, here's a consolatory tidbit: before the flashback, Kaname compares him to a guy in her neighbouring class. Weighs about 100 kilos, permanently sweaty, always smiling evilly to himself and looking at girls with that kind of expression, and boasting of his collection of BDSM publications. And then she says that the only difference between Leonard and the guy is that he looks marginally better - and that the guy, at least, was honest/straightforward about his behaviour. (Ooooh, burn.)

[Weltall Elite]

Pwnt.

It's a fictional story that people read to entertain themselves. If it's a good story, they can immerse themselves in it and feel something when reading it. Hate for a character should be no more shocking than love, admiration or any other feeling.

[Taurec]

I wouldn't care if Amalgam had come in and killed Leonard's puppy in front of him-

You are such a cold cold woman.

...I don't have to like or feel any sympathy for the bad guy.

Nor do I have to feel that for the "good" guy.

He wouldn't have shown Kagome what he did if he weren't trying provoke her sympathy...he says "so you can understand" or something to that effect. So what? Understand what? It's just a way of him trying to pull at her heart strings, no matter what he says to the contrary.

As was stated; Leonard said he didn't expect to be pitied (*shrug*), and that it wasn't an excuse for his behaviour.
I find it highly biased to seek more behind it and this is pure speculation.

http://objection.mrdictionary.net/go.php?n=1349120

And if it got licensed, you still wouldn't read it for years because they would start translating at the beginning of the series.

So? I'm very ... very patient said the spider to the fly.

<-

[sj4iy]

You are such a cold cold woman.

Yup, I sure am. Forgive me if I don't like girly men characters. Never have, never will. I just think it's funny everyone swoons over and pities poor widdle Weonard. And it was an easy mistake to say Kagome instead of Kaname- Leonard reminds me much of Sesshoumaru. I got constant crap for calling him girly on my website for years. And I'm not called the evil overlord at Boku-tachi for nothing >:D

Leonard - wimp
Sousuke - r0x0rz!

[Pyrite]

...Well, just goes to show what tripe I've been reading these days.

Seriously, though, to play the devil's advocate - we're not denying the fact that Leonard's pretty screwed up. If we assume that Resonance lets the Whispered feel everything that went on at the time, we are essentially looking at a kid who, at the age of (I guess) 6 or 7, decided that humanity is the scum of the earth. Betcha things aren't going to turn out so well.

As for whiny, emo, etc., I know you'd really love to see Leonard put on eyeshadow, slit his wrists and listen to Linkin Park, but it's not happening at the moment. (Now, "spoilt", on the other hand, that I can agree with...)

EDIT: Yeah, but when you talk about Kagome and killing the dog in the same post, one wonders.

[sj4iy]

*shrugs*

Doesn't really matter what Leonard does- I'm not going to like/dislike him more. I guess I'm very simple in my demands in stories. Besides, it's more fun to make fun of Leonard. How much fun is it to start feeling for a character whom you know is going to get it in the end? It's more fun to build up a dislike of him, then when he DOES get it, you're all like "w00t!"

[Pyrite]

Not surprised, and perfectly understandable. But what the heck, arguing's fun if done within reasonable limits. (Hey, I like making fun of Leonard too - if only because of my penchant for random simulatory violence.)

Codarl Chidori Custom~

I soooo want to see that.

Additional trivia: "Codarl" should, apparently, read "Chodar", and is some obscure rank in demonology for demons like Belial. (The Chinese translation read "Prince of Hell".) Not that I'd know anything about the field, but it fits with what we've seen so far.

[sj4iy]

Blame ADV for that one...they are the ones that determined the romanization for Codarl. They also determined the romanizations for Urzu, Geybo, etc., when those were clearly wrong. Guess it won't matter too much now that they aren't doing it anymore, but the damage has been done :/

[Pyrite]

Yeah, but I think this one's excusable - there wasn't a precedent Amalgam suit to set a naming trend, plus it's pretty hard to guess "Chodar": the only references I could find that made sense was a transcript of Thomas Nashe's "Pierce Peniless" and some French site which I ran through Babelfish.

Running the katakana through Google didn't help either.

[sj4iy]

No, any japanese version of a foreign name or word is pretty much a shot in the dark as to the spelling. There's just no way to know for sure unless you understand the context it is being taken in. Of course, names are difficult for anyone in any language.

[Weltall Elite]

(I wonder what Leonard thinks of Kalinin anyway. And did Sousuke even feel regret about killing until Leonard brought up the matter? I don't think so, but I don't recall.)

Kaname thought he did. She told Leonard that he felt didn't enjoy the life he lived. She told Sousuke that his eyes always looked sad when she first met him. Even then, I don't think he was happy living the way he did. I just think he didn't know any other way to live.

Leonard... it's hard for me to view him as anything more than a self-centered, conceited, spoiled brat. So his mom screwed him over when he was a kid. He's going to live the rest of his life out to get payback on the rest of the world? Cry me a river. Why do the smartest people do the dumbest things? The sad part is that I don't doubt that Gatoh might actually make Kaname dumb enough to actually buy into his crap.

[ricerocket]

I wouldn't care if Amalgam had come in and killed Leonard's puppy in front of him- he's the bad guy...I don't have to like or feel any sympathy for the bad guy. He wouldn't have shown Kagome what he did if he weren't trying provoke her sympathy...he says "so you can understand" or something to that effect. So what? Understand what? It's just a way of him trying to pull at her heart strings, no matter what he says to the contrary. I'm just saying that the difference between him and Sousuke is that Sousuke doesn't make excuses. He doesn't say "I did what I did b/c of this and this and this". Kaname does that for him- SHE'S the one who has rationalized what Sousuke's done, not Sousuke himself. She wouldn't do that for Leonard, and that's why Leonard's shows her what happened.

And if it got licensed, you still wouldn't read it for years because they would start translating at the beginning of the series.

actually that's not correct, kaname provoked him first "you are the kind of guy who hides everything from everyone because you are a coward whereas sousuke would not ever lie to me" and then she made the comparison between him and some disgusting pervert Pyrite already talked about, and that's why he passed her those visions, cuz he's mad lol

if you read the text you really don't get the feeling that leonard is going for sympathy :p

[ricerocket]

Kaname thought he did. She told Leonard that he felt didn't enjoy the life he lived. She told Sousuke that his eyes always looked sad when she first met him. Even then, I don't think he was happy living the way he did. I just think he didn't know any other way to live.

Leonard... it's hard for me to view him as anything more than a self-centered, conceited, spoiled brat. So his mom screwed him over when he was a kid. He's going to live the rest of his life out to get payback on the rest of the world? Cry me a river. Why do the smartest people do the dumbest things? The sad part is that I don't doubt that Gatoh might actually make Kaname dumb enough to actually buy into his crap.

that's probably what most people who watched too much "league of justice" as kids would think XD

the whole point a lot of people are missing is that a guy like leonard is doing what he's doing NOT because of revenge.. they do NOT think what they are doing is a bad thing; in fact, most terrorists believe whole heartedly that they are sacrificing for the greater good, that they are making the world better

it doesn't matter that leonard may be the smartest kid in the world, he was still just a kid when terrorists took him in, trained him, brainwashed him, and it's not much different than your parents and teachers who keep on telling you "saving lives is a noble thing", the only difference was what people told leonard instead "killing people is a noble thing" .... although i guess they'd put the idea in a much better context XD

[Mecha]

Doesn't really matter what Leonard does- I'm not going to like/dislike him more. I guess I'm very simple in my demands in stories. Besides, it's more fun to make fun of Leonard. How much fun is it to start feeling for a character whom you know is going to get it in the end? It's more fun to build up a dislike of him, then when he DOES get it, you're all like "w00t!"

Actually I strongly disagree with you in this. Its always great when villains get charachter and its explained why they do what they do. It makes them more realistic than basic american cartoon villains and this is great thing in some anime. Those have too black & white picture of good and evil. Have you seen Cowboy Bebop the Movie? I have and one reason why I loved it was becouse of Vincent Vallejo was so realistic villain with actual motives. Same thing is clearly going to be with Leonard.